Wii Remote

[Power666]

The Wii is a bit odd in that it has a bunch of 'standard' input devices. The system itself some with a Wii remote and nunchuku. Also allowed are GameCube controllers, Wii Classic controler and Nintendo DS (unused thus far). The USB ports on the Wii could be used for a standard keyboard/mouse set up.

I do agree that motion sensing isn't thing that can effectively be used in all games but the Wii does have plenty of alternative inputs that it isn't an issue for developers. However, there is a great incentive to include support for it from Nintendo and the fact that the system comes with the Wii remote in the first place.

I however woud disagree that motion sensing makes list in the first post worth missing out. Motion controls in many of those titles are done right.

[Icemage]

Originally Posted by Power666

The Wii is a bit odd in that it has a bunch of 'standard' input devices. The system itself some with a Wii remote and nunchuku. Also allowed are GameCube controllers, Wii Classic controler and Nintendo DS (unused thus far). The USB ports on the Wii could be used for a standard keyboard/mouse set up.

I do agree that motion sensing isn't thing that can effectively be used in all games but the Wii does have plenty of alternative inputs that it isn't an issue for developers. However, there is a great incentive to include support for it from Nintendo and the fact that the system comes with the Wii remote in the first place.

We're back to the argument of standard vs. optional again, though. Why don't Xbox 360 titles generally require a hard drive? Because it's not standard, and a sizable chunk of the audience doesn't have one.

Why don't Wii games generally require a Classic Controller? Again, because a sizable chunk of the audience doesn't have one.

There's really only two ways to do inputs on a console; package it with the standard hardware like the way the Wii Remote is, or provide specialized hardware for specific games (Link's Crossbow Training, Guitar Hero, Rock Band, The Eye of Judgment, Time Crisis 4, SingStar).

I don't ever see a time when the Classic Controller, or any other the other bizarro attachments that Nintendo has been dreaming up, will ever see widespread use unless they get provided directly with a game that people actually want.

I however woud disagree that motion sensing makes list in the first post worth missing out. Motion controls in many of those titles are done right.

With the exception of Twilight Princess, I agree, the most of the motion controls in most of the games in the first post make sense. Unfortunately there's quite a large laundry list of games on the Wii where the motion controls don't make sense, and that list is much, much larger due to the tendency of developers to just shoehorn controls into the waggle scheme just for the sake of having it.

[Power666]

Originally Posted by Icemage

We're back to the argument of standard vs. optional again, though. Why don't Xbox 360 titles generally require a hard drive? Because it's not standard, and a sizable chunk of the audience doesn't have one.

I don't ever see a time when the Classic Controller, or any other the other bizarro attachments that Nintendo has been dreaming up, will ever see widespread use unless they get provided directly with a game that people actually want.

Optional != requirement
Requirement != optional

Game that don't work well with motion sensing to not have to use it on the Wii. The Wii remote does provide a standard D-pad and a few buttons that developers can work with. Most of the games where motion sensing may not be ideal can be generally worked into such basic controls with a few compromises. The uncompromised version of the controls can also be included for use with the Classic Controller, GameCube controller or other input method as an option.

Originally Posted by Icemage

With the exception of Twilight Princess, I agree, the most of the motion controls in most of the games in the first post make sense. Unfortunately there's quite a large laundry list of games on the Wii where the motion controls don't make sense, and that list is much, much larger due to the tendency of developers to just shoehorn controls into the waggle scheme just for the sake of having it.

I had no troubles with the motion controls in Twilight Princess except for the fishing (for some reason fishing seems broken).

[Icemage]

Originally Posted by Power666

Optional != requirement
Requirement != optional

Game that don't work well with motion sensing to not have to use it on the Wii. The Wii remote does provide a standard D-pad and a few buttons that developers can work with. Most of the games where motion sensing may not be ideal can be generally worked into such basic controls with a few compromises. The uncompromised version of the controls can also be included for use with the Classic Controller, GameCube controller or other input method as an option.

Try putting a multi-button beat-em-up like Tekken or Soul Calibur on the Wii Remote + Nunchuk and see how far you get.

The point is that, in the cases where the Wii Remote + Nunchuk does not suffice for a control scheme, the accessories needed MUST be provided or you end up with people who have to shell out extra (and go out of their way to do so) for whatever hardware they need to play the game.

Sure, you "could" play Guitar Hero by mapping the guitar buttons and such to the buttons on a controller, but would anyone seriously want to play it that way, even if you could readily buy the guitar controllers as an accessory?

I had no troubles with the motion controls in Twilight Princess except for the fishing (for some reason fishing seems broken).

Fighting with motion control was flaky, and doing the spin attack wasn't as consistent as it ought to have been. As far as I'm concerned, the GameCube version of the game plays remarkably better aside from the archery portions.

[Leonidas]

Originally Posted by Shpeshal Ed

It was INTENDED originally as a Gamecube peripheral.

You are 100 times wrong. God I hate this thread straight up it's like on a one way trip to locksville.

Originally Posted by Icemage

The point is that, in the cases where the Wii Remote + Nunchuk does not suffice for a control scheme, the accessories needed MUST be provided or you end up with people who have to shell out extra (and go out of their way to do so) for whatever hardware they need to play the game.

Oh right, lets pack a gamecube controller in with every copy of Brawl. Logic ftw.

For as long as all 4, 5, 17, however many wii inputs are available, things are fine how they are.


Ps; Motion control in Zelda is perfect imo (Big surprise right). The gamecube version plays 'remarkably better'?

1. Wow you played both? Can I ask why?
2. Care to elaborate on 'better'? Pressing a button is better than fliking the remote, that's what you mean, right?

[Icemage]

Originally Posted by Leonidas

Ps; Motion control in Zelda is perfect imo (Big surprise right). The gamecube version plays 'remarkably better'?

1. Wow you played both? Can I ask why?

Because my nieces picked it up for their GameCube a month before I got my Wii with Twilight Princess?

2. Care to elaborate on 'better'? Pressing a button is better than fliking the remote, that's what you mean, right?

In essence, yes. Combat on the GameCube version is a LOT tighter and more accurate with respect to timing (not that you really need it since fighting is so retardedly easy, but nonetheless...).

The ONLY thing the Wii version better is the shooting. For straight swordplay, the GameCube version is more responsive, more effective, and less annoying (that and the extra skills you learn from the Wolf Spirit are easier to do, particularly the Shield Strike and Back Slice techniques, which require waggle on the Wii version - and doesn't always register).

[Power666]

Originally Posted by Icemage

Try putting a multi-button beat-em-up like Tekken or Soul Calibur on the Wii Remote + Nunchuk and see how far you get.

Will in the case of button mashing games like Tekken, the fewer buttons on the Wii remote isn't a handicap but rather an advantage.

In all seriousness, a workable control scheme can be done on the Wii remote but for any serious player, a Classic Controller or GameCube controller would be more ideal. Note that I did say a bit of a compromise maybe necessary for some games to map to just the Wii remote without using motion sensing. That does not mean other other input devices are required nor does a developer have to exclude them either.

Originally Posted by Icemage

Sure, you "could" play Guitar Hero by mapping the guitar buttons and such to the buttons on a controller, but would anyone seriously want to play it that way, even if you could readily buy the guitar controllers as an accessory?

Guitar Hero and Rockband etc., are two games where including the special input devices makes sense.

Unlike guitars, the Classic Controller and GameCube controller work for a wider variety of games. Again, it is up to the developers to include support for them and for some games they would work better than the Wii remote.

Originally Posted by Icemage

Fighting with motion control was flaky, and doing the spin attack wasn't as consistent as it ought to have been. As far as I'm concerned, the GameCube version of the game plays remarkably better aside from the archery portions.

You had problems pulling off the spin attack?!?!?! I had no issues with that what so ever. I really can't think of any issue with the controls except for fishing. I think the issues with fishing deals less with the controls and more with how it was designed in the game to begin with.

[Power666]

Originally Posted by Leonidas

You are 100 times wrong. God I hate this thread straight up it's like on a one way trip to locksville.

Nope, he's actually right. Take a look at this link from this thread.

Originally Posted by Leonidas

Oh right, lets pack a gamecube controller in with every copy of Brawl. Logic ftw.

This is a bit unnecessary as there are plenty of GameCube controllers in the wild. Fans of Melee already have a GameCube and thus a GameCube controller. It really is a non-issue in this specific case.

[Leonidas]

I agree with Power666, I'd just like to mention I didn't even realize you can use the pointer for the bow until I finished the game.

[edit] refering to post 37

I also had no probs with any of the sword techniques, blame the player, not the game. Doesn't always register, sure, easier with a button obviously, but if you do it right every time it registers everytime.

Which is an argument I wish I could load into a gun and shoot ppl with somehow. Tbh.



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As for the wii remote, there is absolutely no evidence that it was ever considered for use with the gamecube, only that it was being worked on, which is no surprise.

Sorry if I came off jaunty that debate carried on from another thread.

[Power666]

Originally Posted by Leonidas

*garble*
*garble*
*garble*

Huh? How about reposting using some cohesiveness so that others can follow exactly what you're trying to say and actually attempt to understand it.